Male Camaraderie and Marriage
Last night I was shocked to see the most unlikeliest of movies deal with a subject that almost every guy can relate to but one that we rarely deal with. My wife and I were watching Knocked Up, and in between the F-bombs and inappropriate sex stuff (I recommend waiting for the edited version on TV), there was a great message about finding a balance between your marriage and your need for male camaraderie.The secondary story in the movie deals with a married couple who is having real problems in their marriage. The wife, Debbie, is nagging and controlling, the husband, Pete, seems like he doesn’t care about anything, and their kids take up all their time and energy. At one point Debbie thinks Pete is cheating on her and she tries to catch him, but instead of lying to her and sleeping with another woman, Pete has been lying to her and doing guy things, like going to fantasy baseball drafts and watching Spider-Man 3.
That’s a temptation that I’m sure a lot of men can relate to because it hits on a significant truth. God designed men to be in relationships with one another, not just with our wives and our children. Sadly, that’s less and less the case these days. An article last year from Best Life magazine stated that “in the last two decades, men have shed nearly half their male friendships.” Between working long hours and spending time with their families, men today are often just too busy to make time for their buddies.
But, as Proverbs 27:17 states, “As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.” We need our time with the guys. We need time to crack jokes, watch sports and eat meat together so we don’t lose that masculine edge God placed in our hearts. We also need time to get past the surface details and share our lives and struggles with one another, keeping one another accountable and encouraging one another in our Christian walks.
Balancing that time with your family and work time is a challenge, but it’s one that’s worth fighting for. In the end, it will benefit all the walks of your life.
posted by Editor at 4:12 PM
20 Comments:
As a husband and father of three young kids, my time is very limited to meet with other men, so I can relate to what you are saying.
In fact, I try to make all my meetings with other guys in the mornings or during lunch when my family is still sleeping or I'm already away from them at work.
When I measure the value of spending several hours in a night (even if it is infrequent) with a bunch of guys hanging around watching sports or doing other "guy" things versus the value of spending QT with my kids, there is really no match.
My kids win every time.
I start to wonder whether the things we say are NEEDED and should be valued are really culture or biblical. Afterall, how much iron is really getting sharpened during Monday night football with the guys?
Pierre Eade
www.christiangrowthnetwork.com
I hope to hear some other guys ring in on this one. I thought the article made some good points, I think men DO need to sharpen one another.
But man Pierre, although my kids are not quite so young now, my wife values my time even more now because of her physical restrictions, you describing your life sounds like describing my life to a "T" as well.
I believe very strongly in ministering to men, we need them back in the life of the church, I am sincerely seeking ways to get men into our church, and the men in our church motivated.
I do think there are times for men to gather together, I just question in what venue. I would also be interested in just what the term "masculine edge" is supposed to mean. Really, isn't macho just another term for male ego?
While I agree with your premise, why would you watch a movie like Knocked Up? There are plenty of other sources to get this message without having to watch trash movies. Christian men and couples need to use more discernment in what they watch. That would be my message.
I too wonder why a Christian would be watching a movie like this. I'm tired of being told by Christians that this is all that is out there and you just have to overlook the language and sex situations. What a cop-out. If I don't want my children to watch it, I certainly won't. If Jesus wa sitting next to you, would you REALLY be ok watching Knocked Up?
I think the point of the posting is being lost when comments are made about watching a movie like Knocked Up. Not watching Hollywood movies is not the issue. I will watch anything I percieve to be true art, e.g The Godfather; Saving Private Ryan; 2001; Braveheart; LA Confidential. The fact all these movies are rated R and contain violence, nudity, cursing is not the point. Am I enriched by the art being made. Answer: yes.
The real point is men needing to spend time with other men. This is a crisis for Christian men. Men are marginalized and miserable in the churches. Many men do not have male friends other than the husbands of their wives friends. In the past two years I have been able to develop and re-develop significant male friendships. My relationship with Christ has been strengthened as has my relationship with my wife. My wife does not have to be my only friend. Too many Christian men find themselves in this situation.
Yes Vince, I agree that men need companionship with other men...but that doesn't excuse watching movies that play up sex before marriage, foul language...why mess up your mind with that stuff?
I agree 100% with your comments on male friends...and guys being able to be guys. But I must admit that when you couched it in the context of watching a raunchy movie, I knew you'd lose some guys who'd rather criticize you for your taste in movies than applaud you for your stand on behalf of men being men.
It reminds me of the pastor who stood up in the pulpit one sunday morning to talk about abortion and said "during the next 20 minutes while I preach, 60 babies in America will be killed by abortion...and most of America does not give a damn." He paused. "And more of you in this church just got more upset about me saying 'damn' than you did about those babies being murdered."
...but that doesn't excuse watching movies that play up sex before marriage, foul language...why mess up your mind with that stuff?
It's not about messing up one's mind; it's about actions and behaviors.
Ah...I'm not missing your point. I do, really do realize the need for male companionship...it is essential for our growth....iron sharpens iron. I guess another thread needs to be started about the need to watch movies that have sex scenes and bad language and why that isn't necessarily good for you.
Again, it is not about the "need" to watch movies with sex scenes, cursing, violence, etc. Passion of the Christ was one of the most violent, bloody movies ever made. Of course making this your primary form of entertainment is not healthy; but some r rated movies do carry significant artistic value.
Artistic value or not, you must admit, most, if not all R rated movies contains some sex and profane language. What does the Bible say about focusing on what is lovely, good, etc. Would you in all honesty say you would feel comfortable having Jesus sit next to you while watching a movie of questionable worth?
If I am watching a moviw with significant artisitic value or with a siginificant message; yes I'd feel comfortable with Jesus sitting mext to me. Would you not take the time to watch Saving Private Ryan or Schindler's List? Braveheart? Again, it's about the content and intent.
I don't think Christians should be putting garbage in their minds, just because they think it is art. Now that being said, I left that alone because I was hoping to hear some real comments on the issue raised by the original post, but this thread has been hi-jacked by the movie issue, which no one seems to to able to get past :-(
It believe it is difficult for men to maintain solid male friendships. Long hours at the office, family responsibilities and church can drain us until we have no time nor the energy to work at a male friendship. My wife has three close lady friends that she shares prayer, concerns and good times with. They go places together and have a ball. Why is it so difficult for men to do that. Of course, it doesn't help me that I don't like football...and in Texas, that's almost a requirement to talk about football if you want to hang on to your male friends. :)
The original topic of male camaraderie is extremely important. I'll reiterate what I posted previously; men are marginalized and miserable in the churches. Many men do not have male friends other than the husbands of their wives friends. This has to change. We need to feed off each other to become better men. Gents, I suggest starting a running or cycling group at your church. Or any activity that will get men to participate. Use these group as the foundation for creating new, strong male relationships.
I would like to hear any suggestions for activities, or maybe what may have worked for others. I, like Anonymous, am not a big sports fan.
Also, I am back on shift work, so my schedule moves all the time, I never have a consistent day or time off. Is there anyone else out there in this situation that has found something that has worked for them?
Chuck,
What do you like to do? Find out if this activity is something other men in your church, home group, etc. enjoy and start doing it together. My church has also found cycling, hiking, running, fishing, and camping groups to be a great way for men to gather together and minister to each other. Prayer breakfasts/barbecues have also worked. Get active and minister to each other.
I'm curious as to why the statement "men are not comfortable in church" is being made. I think some men are comfortable. I'm not but it seems if guys have buddies there they seem settled in. To pick up on the wife and friends.. It seems my wife goes out w/her friends but somebody has to feed the kids!!
For what it is worth, I am comfortable in my church. I do not have any "real" male friends or any "real" female friends (I would not recommend the latter to any married man)...however, I am close to all of my wife's friends husbands. We are friends, in that we are there for each other no matter what, no matter what time, etc...we do pray together, we do hang out...albeit the times that we are doing these things is either 1. unplanned and spur of the moment or 2. a time that our wives has set up for them to hang out together...and we are the afterthought. I am not disatisfied with this...I think men are just different than women. I don't think that men have that drive or desire to have a best friend or a need to meet for a time of social nonsense with their buddies...if it happens, it happens...if not...so what. I am just saying that my life is this: God/Jesus, my wife, my kids, my job...after that, honestly there isn't a whole lot of time left. If the opportunity to hang out with my friends comes up ...then i'll be there...but if not, Thank God for my wife and family who are my best friends anyway.
I do allow my husband to spend time with his friends but he spends 3-4times a week with them. isn't that too much?
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